Sid: I believe that God has risen up my guest I’m speaking to him at his office in Tulsa, Oklahoma the he’s Senior Pastor of Family Prayer Center Dave Roberson just for you. Dave many people would question why did Jesus fast for 40 days? Why was it even necessary? What did he really accomplish by fasting?
Dave: Sid it says in Matthew 4 that Jesus is led up of the Spirit He was led into the wilderness by the Holy Spirit to be tempted by the devil. And while He was in the wilderness He fasted for 40 days. And the question I had over that in the Lord’s prayer He said “Lead us not into temptation.” Yet here He’s saying that He was led up the Spirit into the wilderness for the purpose of being tempted by Satan. See when He went into the wilderness He was actually going in as part of the substitution in identification work that He did for you and I. Such as He was made to be sin, you and I was made the righteousness of God in Christ. He bore our sicknesses and He carried our pains that we might be whole. And the chastisement of our lack of peace was laid up Him with His stripes we were healed. So He began the redemption work substitution identification when he was led by the Holy Spirit into the wilderness to be tempted by the devil. But He fasted to shut His flesh down to prepare Himself for that temptation. And He went out into the wilderness as my substitute to be tempted in my place. So He fastest to prepare His flesh to face Satan and He was tempted in 3 realms, 3 areas spirit, soul and body. In the Body it says that “If you are the Son of God turn of God turn those stones into bread.” And Jesus He stood up to him the horriblest strongest temptation that could ever be brought to a man. Jesus had to be able to stand up under it and He did and He said “Man shall not live by bread alone but by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God.” So Satan then moved his temptations up a level into the soul when he couldn’t defeat Him on the level of the flesh. And he said “If You’re the Son of God jump off the pinnacle of the temple he said because it’s written that the angels would bare you up less you dash Your foot against a stone.” And Jesus resisted the emotional level of torment and temptation that would put a man in the levels of an insane asylum on the miss interpretation of a verse. He said “Jump off the pinnacle of the temple” as he tempted him in the emotions of the soul he said “Jump off.” And Jesus resisted and He says “I will not tempt God.” So when he could not defeat Him in the realms of the soul he moved onto the realms of the spirit. And he said “Look I’ll make you a world ruler” he said “Look at all of the kingdoms of this world look at the glory of them, look at the wealth of them all you have to do is fall down and worship me” and he said “I’ll give all of them and all of the glory of them to you.” And Jesus said “I will not,” He said “I’ll worship the God and God alone will I serve.” And so He was tempted inconceivably in those 3 areas spirit, soul and body as my substitute and he defeated Satan. And then as an act of grace that victory that standing that he received from passing that temptation and defeating Satan by an act of grace He turned around you and I Sid and by grace He gave us His standing that standing that He defeated Satan with. So that when you turn around to the devil and say “Come out” that devil has to come out because Jesus defeated him in the wilderness. So Jesus fasted for the same reason that you and I fast that was to prepare his flesh for that temptation that Satan tried to bring Him under and defeat Him with. So somebody asked me “Well what if the devil doesn’t come out when I tell him to come out Brother Roberson?” I said “This is why Jesus said ‘This kind cometh out by prayer and fasting.’” Fasting will drive your flesh down below the level of the operation of your spirit and enforces that position of grace that Jesus gives you which is His standing. When that standing He has given you is free then those devils will come out because it’s not you see it’s Him. So He fasted Sid for the same reason that you and I fast and that was to positionally or to prepare His flesh for that temptation and to defeat Satan.
Sid: Dave for the past number of years there have been men and women moving in a very strong anointing we’ve been calling it revival and then people’s lives have been touched and they literally got excited and passionate for the Lord. But then over a period of time they slipped back to right where they were before. Is this really revival that’s it’s been labeled as revival in a number of churches in America?
Dave: What I’ve seen Sid is what some classify as revival you know I wouldn’t classify it as revival and a lot of times when the pastor is not hungry you know and people will get hungry and he said “One being taught is not above the disciple the one teaching him or the teacher.” And a lot of people are just held there just held passively in one place to just abide their time till the years go by and they remain exactly the same they just kind of babysit them in their salvation until Jesus comes. I’ve seen moves of the Spirit and things they classify as revival, but then and but then I’ve seen and read about revival that has come in times past and I haven’t seen too many of them but I have seen some. One was in the Amazon State in Brazil by a man Sid that got our fasting series and right now he’s causing a raging revival in the village along the Amazon. But this man we trained for 5 years and for the last 6 months up to this time in fact this last year for 6 months he did the series fasting a few days on and off. And ended it with a 36 day fast and was caught up into heaven Sid and they talked to the creatures that worshipped God around the throne and came back. And he told me 1000’s are pouring out now down in the Amazon and they’re coming to this village wherever he is they’re laying them down and they’re getting them healed. I mean the things that are happening are absolutely incredible.
Sid: Are you impressed with a seeker sensitive church that’s got 5000 people and just seems to grow and grow and grow, but really isn’t close to a demonstration to the power of God are you impressed with that?
Dave: No not at all Sid. The other day Sid a good friend of mine said “What do you measure the success of your ministry on Brother Roberson?” And I said “That’s easy on the permanent change that it brings in people’s life as they grow in Christ.” No it doesn’t impress me at all because I know that numbers has nothing to do with that.
Sid: Going back to fasting tell me some changes you’ve seen in other people that have moved into fasting.
Dave: The biggest changes that I see Sid is like it happened in me that whatever’s in these ceilings that causes them to be weak the Holy Spirit and the fasting begins to destroy them. And I’ve noticed that it will bring those problems in view where you yourself can see them and understand the weakness and understand the complacency and the difference. Myself I begin to hate those things so bad as He revealed them that God said “Good to me” He said “Good that you hate them because when you loved them indifferently in the world what did I have to work with? But now that you’ve fasted and you hate them as much as I do you’ve given Me something to work with and I can move them out of your life and I can destroy them.” And they range from habitual things to strongholds from people’s past such as being hurt very bad and generational things as they would call and generational things as they would call them, curses and things like that. But the change is phenomenal Sid because as it breaks the power of the flesh.
Sid: I have on the telephone Dave Roberson I’m speaking to him at his office in Tulsa, Oklahoma where he’s Senior Pastor of the Family Prayer Center. And Dave is a man of the Spirit but he had certain limits that he seemed he just couldn’t breakthrough areas in his life that he calls it ceilings, in difference to people that were needy. There was something more and his spirit knew it but there was something limiting him something putting a ceiling on him. And God started teaching him about the true purpose of fasting and his life was revolutionized. Dave tells me something some of the personal things that happened in your own life through fasting the way that God instructed you to.
Dave: Sid after ministering for several years that something would not even know hot explain what it was except that a strongman or ministry came under attack in my mind and since then I’ve run into so many ministers that were under the same attack and have even had been destroyed by it not counting the believers just people that love God. That to this day I thank God for the road that fasting played in bringing me out of that. Because when it seemed that the strongman came almost like an assignment to destroy me even though I was doing camp meetings and people were set free and I’d ministered to them and I’d heard the same thing from so many preachers like there was a ceiling over my ministry I just couldn’t break through. And I’d would go in the service to minister to the people and then I’d go to my hotel room or go home and this torment would begin horrible I mean. And it felt like a 1000 fish hooks was in my flesh and I couldn’t break through it. And so when I learned about fasting I’d begin to fast and to pray and break that off of me. And when I was fasting and praying I didn’t know the role that fasting and praying played at that time, well prayer fasting linked together with prayer. All I knew I just couldn’t go on anymore and I just got so tormented in my emotions I just couldn’t hardly open my Bible I couldn’t pray it didn’t seem like I could do anything. I could remember in desperation I just remembered what people said about fasting, “I’m just going to fast and pray until I break this.” I just…one day I quit eating and even though I was in a fast I still couldn’t pray or anything. But after so many days I woke up and I just felt like I could pray again I could open my Bible again. Well I’d finished that fast but then before the year was over I went on another one and things was waking up and I was getting so hungry for God that on this one I fasted, well I fasted so long that my wife got worried about me that I wasn’t because I had such a supernatural peace on the inside. And near the end of the fast the devil literally manifested himself to me in such a way that he was exposed. I knew what was fighting my ministry I couldn’t see him but I could hear him. And he said to me he said “I’m going to kill you.” And I said “Oh you can’t if you could kill me you’d already done it.” And he said “I’m going to destroy you and your family” but I said “You can’t if you could have done it.” And he threatened me and said “I’m going to empty your church out.” And he almost succeeded in that and I never will forget what followed that fast such an increase in revelation and Satan’s war machine and how he fights and overturns ministries tempts them and draws them off and I’ve learned so much.
Sid: You can understand how well there’s no need to mention by name a number of prominent ministries just hard to believe that slipped, those are the reason?
Dave: Yes when a person fasts you destroy the hold that the flesh has over you and many of them just don’t understand that. A lot of the people they did at that time the devil made it that far to attempt to run people out of the church that I never will forget the result when the day come that I was able to break it. Sid I’ll never forget it I remember when I come out of the prayer closet and had my first prayer life I’ll never forget it that I just lifted my hands to pray for people and it was a line that people got in that were bound by devils habitual things and had a lot of trouble things like smoking and had addictions to drugs and also prescription drugs and a lot of tormented people from their past that had strongholds of abuse, inner healing things the whole front was full of people. And so I got up to lay my hands on some of the first ones and the glory of God came so strong that it literally through them through the air and they landed on their back. And I heard this wimpy little voice and crying out of this one that just couldn’t get free and I mean in the past this wimpy little voice crying and whimpering saying “Do I have to come out?”
Dave: It was the devil talking “Do I have to come out? Do I have to come out?” And I could remember I was so shocked about it that I just simply answered you know I was amazed usually I would muster up my voice of authority you know.
Dave: But I could say and announce it it’s not how large you are, it’s not how quiet you are it’s that if he can come and do what you’re asking Him to do. He said “This kind cometh not but by prayer and fasting.” Anyway I was so shocked at that devil whimpering instead of screaming challenging me like so many had done “I’ll not come out!” many of them would say but this one said “Do I have to come out?” And just the voice like I’m talking to you I said “Yes you do, you have to come out.” And he came out and this was happening to many people. And Sid this I found out that fasting it is absolute death sentence to indifference and complacency and this is what Jesus was talking about prophecy in Isaiah 58 in the 7th verse it says “This is the fast he’s chosen this is the fast He has chosen He said to give thy bread to the hungry, that you bring the poor that are cast out of your house, that when you see the naked that you cover him.” And then he said “That you hide not yourself from your own flesh.” And this verse I didn’t know what that means. I said “Father God what do you mean that you hide not yourself from your flesh?” Well I can tell you now, Sid the day that a man decides to fast, the day is the day that you’ve decided not to hide from your own flesh anymore. You’ve decided to quit hiding from whatever it is on the inside of you it just doesn’t care about the naked, that just doesn’t care about the poor, about the hungry about those that are cast out of God’s house whatever it is that’s in you just does not care. The day that you decide to fast is the day that you’ve decided to quit hiding from your own flesh whatever it is that is in you that just doesn’t care. Nobody has to show you movies anymore, the starving children, the horrendous needs of people in the world to be saved; surely you’re need you’re not hiding anymore. Fasting is a death sentence to indifference and complacency.
Sid: Dave when you talk about fasting there’s a lot of questions that are triggered, “Is Dave intimated that I should fast for 40 days, what does he mean by fasting what is he telling me to do?” How would you answer that?
Dave: When a man fast there are several levels of fasting and the highest is nothing but water and lock yourself away. But the serious of fasting the personal fast a few days on and a few days off and possibly just drink a little bit of liquids in a partial fast. But there are times when people fast 40 days and they were discouraged because nothing appeared to happen. But you have to remember your fast is not moving God it’s moving you into a place by destroying the flesh to receive from God so don’t get discouraged.
Sid: Would a one day fast benefit moving into these areas?
Dave: Yes it would because in serious fasting or one day, 10, or even 40 the thing is don’t stop just keep going back to fasting don’t get discouraged don’t put all of your eggs in one basket. Say 40 day and you don’t see what you wanted to see because you actually line upon line you moving your flesh out of the way and moving yourself into a place of the Spirit. It may take a little longer but eventually you will cross that line and you will see God begin to move for you like He’s never moved before.
Sid: Dave I believe that we’re talking to specific believers right now that God orchestrated for them to listen to this discussion that God has heard their prayers and is saying “This is your answer.”
Sid: I have on the telephone Dave Roberson he’s Senior Pastor of the Family Prayer Center in Tulsa, Oklahoma. And we’re talking about a revelation that Dave received from God that allows believers to get from the level they’re at in the Spirit where they’ve been for years and years and years and breakthrough to where God really wants them. Others have been praying for years and years and years and it’s almost as though “Well I believe God’s going to answer this prayer someday” but year after year after year you’re praying and you’re not seeing results. Others don’t have the intimacy with God Dave for many years you’ve been a man of the Spirit. You spent many many days praying 5, 6, 7, 8 hours in tongues, you really have been moving in the Spirit. But when you got the revelation on fasting that it wasn’t something that moves God. What does fasting really do, you told us on yesterday’s broadcast, but review that what does fasting really do for you?
Dave: Well in Romans 8:10 because I wondered when that devil wouldn’t come out that Jesus had ended up casting out for the disciples the apostles and they turned around and asked Him “Why wouldn’t that devil come out?” He was very plain He said “He would not come out because of your unbelief.” And then he went on to say something tremendous “If you have faith as a grain of mustard seed you could say to that mountain be removed and be cast beyond us and it would obey you.” And then He said “Absolutely nothing, nothing should be impossible to you.” So the disciples had been casting devils out up until that time and suddenly a devil just would not come out. And when they asked Jesus the reason He said “It’s because of your unbelief.” So when I saw this I thought to myself “Well if the primary reason that devil wouldn’t come out is because of their unbelief then I wondered what in the world does fasting have to do with unbelief? Now what does going without eating what does that have to do with my unbelief period? But yet it does because Jesus said that “If you ever dealt with this particular unbelief.” You know the kind that the apostles had or the disciples had that day when they couldn’t cast that devil out. Because if they knew why they couldn’t cast that devil out they wouldn’t have asked Jesus but they couldn’t get it to come out so they asked Him why? He said “Because of your unbelief.” So we’re talking about a very seductive, deceptive kind of unbelief that had put a ceiling on a person’s life. A kind of unbelief that we don’t even know that we have for one year is like the next until decades turn into generations and pretty soon our whole life can go by.
Sid: Do you believe that people have a very specific destiny from God and many people never even know what it is let alone accomplish it?
Dave: I do because of these kind of ceilings that’s over their life and the unbelief that’s involved we bounce off of that ceiling prisoned in that world of unbelief many times. Put into that world by doctrines that people preach and teach that’s not exactly true. It puts us in a holding tank and we spin our wheels all of our lives and we don’t know why we can’t break through into our ministries and our calls. Just like this particular kind of unbelief they didn’t know why they had it but He told them that they devil wouldn’t come out because of your unbelief. Meaning, Sid if you and I ever learned how to deal with that kind of unbelief that He was talking about that subtle kind that we spend years in sometimes just not knowing how to breakout. But if we ever learn to deal with it we’ve got a person promise from Jesus that absolutely nothing and I mean nothing would be impossible to you. But then He said “How be it…” an analytical word, “…how be it this kind He said to come out by nothing but prayer and fasting. And that certainly wasn’t the prayer that hovered over the demon possessed boy because that one didn’t work. He was talking about a lifestyle of prayer. But He said “By prayer and fasting.” And so my question to God I said “Oh Father what does fasting have to do with my unbelief especially that very subtle kind that a person doesn’t even know that they have and just explain a little bit on that?” Let’s say that the whole room was full of wheelchairs and children in them and Jesus walked in and emptied all of the wheelchairs in His glorify body and I’ve said I’d already prayed for him and I couldn’t…why didn’t you do that when I prayed? He’d turn to me and say the same thing. He’d say “Son it was because of your unbelief.” But then I know Jesus and he does not speak a problem he doesn’t outline a problem without going on and giving the answer to the problem before He’s finished. And I knew that if He walked into the room he would tell me exactly the same thing He told His apostle that day. He said that “It’s because of your unbelief how be it this kind will come out but prayer and fasting?” Now He just wasn’t talking about deliverance He said “You see that mountain and you could speak to it and that mountain would move.” He was talking about power and ministry when you can destroy those kind of ceilings that keep you in the same place your whole life time see. So my question “What does it have to do with unbelief?” And that’s when I found out Romans 8 and 10 “If Christ is in me,” and He is, my spirit is already seated in heavenly places with Him. He didn’t say “It’s alive.” People in hell are alive my spirit has entered into the Zoe that kind of new nature life with Him. But my body has been declared dead as far as its ability to reign over my spirit positionally the carnal appetites of the flesh has had its position provided for it which is dead. And fasting enforces that position. When I began to fast then it began to drive my flesh down below an operation of my spirit. And I used to think fasting moved God but the moment my flesh dropped below the operation of my spirit things that I’d been believing for, power I had longed to operate in, habits that were not pleasing to God they begin to die. And prayers that I had on hold for years began to come to past.
Sid: Can you get a little specific in your life Dave?
Sid: Tell me specific things that happened to Dave Roberson.
Dave: Marilyn Hickey’s and Wally Hickey’s and I had gravitated towards the flesh and felt like I was out of control. I kept getting no peace and I asked Marilyn “Can you help me?” She said “Yes I can get you an appointment Dr. Cho.” I said “Oh thank you” but on the way home in my airplane God told me he said “Do you remember I told you to go as far into Me as you could?” I got home Sid and canceled my meetings and I managed to go on a longer fast and 2½ fasts later I entered into…I mean I broke levels the flesh off of me and a peace came back the torment left, a peace came back so strong I finally ended up doing a teaching on “Peace the aggressive weapon of God” because it broke the power of the flesh. When I first entered into it Sid I couldn’t even read my Bible hardly I couldn’t do anything it’s so crazy and I couldn’t have any peace to pray and even open my Bible felt like a thousand fish hooks was pulling my flesh back…
Sid: What was stopping you from opening your Bible?
Dave: Emotions that were unexplainable, I mean they were so strong I couldn’t force myself to do it like a supernatural presence had gotten ahold of me and was tormenting me. And for the first days of the fast Sid I just laid there on the bed and went “Uhhhh” and I couldn’t do anything hardly but I refused to eat. And it wasn’t too long into the flesh and one day I woke up I felt like praying again, you know I felt like opening my Bible again. Something had broken and I didn’t know at that time that I had driven my flesh down below the operation of the life that was in my spirit and I started getting free. It was a tremendous thing (Laughing) when I think back over it now you know I just want to cry.
Sid: You know I’ve heard your series on peace.
Sid: Explain just briefly what is this peace you have experienced every believer experiences peace from time to time as they walk with the Lord.
Dave: Yes Sid when the further I walked out of the flesh and into His love He said “That where I am you may be also as I am so are you in this world. Seated at the right hand of the Father in His glorified humanity as man and as God.” He talked about it “So are you in this world.” That peace He has there I can have here. And the further I got into God’s love the stronger this peace got. But there isn’t that there isn’t tornadoes that come right up to me that die right at the tip of my toes. It’s not that there not alive and around me but they do not enter in, not meat, eat and drink but righteousness, peace and joy they do not get in. And when I conquered that would of peace on the inside that’s when I began to conquer the world around me. I used to have to have God changed the world around me to have peace but now if He can change that world on the inside of you that’s the key to changing the world around you. And boy that peace is one of the strongest things I ever ever had the pleasure of walking with, with my Savior.
SID: Hello. Sid Roth here. Welcome to my world where it’s naturally supernatural. My guest carries so much of the presence of the Glory of God, of the Spirit of God. This is going to be hard for you to believe, she’s driving along one day and a stranger, someone she doesn’t even know, jumps into her car. She stopped to leave her children off. Jumps into her car and says, “You’re beautiful.” Now what would you do? I’ll tell you what she did. She didn’t do anything. The Glory of God, the fire of God jumped off of her on this man. He starts sweating profusely, starts shaking and then she leads him to Jesus. Do you want to know about that fire? That Glory is for you. You know, I travel all the time like you, but I have never had someone sit next to me like Alice Cresswell. Tell me about this man that got stuck next to you on a plane. There was nowhere else for him to go.
ALISS: What do you mean stuck next to me?
SID: He’s thinking, how can I exit.
ALISS: He was pinned in because he was by the window because I’m in the middle. There’s another guy to my right.
SID: That’s even worse.
ALISS: So I’m just sitting there minding my own business. We’re just about to take off and as I’m looking out through the window I notice the guy to my left by the window is starting to look a little bit red in the face. And then I notice he’s got beads of sweat begin to appear on his forehead and start to trickle down the side of his face.
SID: Now if that happened to me I’d think the person was sick.
ALISS: Well to be honest I just thought, well maybe he’s scared of flying, and I was actually starting to think maybe I ought to offer to pray and say, is there a problem with flying. But before I had a chance to even think about what I was going to say he just turned to me and he said, “What’s that? What is that?” And I was like, “What’s what?” And he said, “There is so much fire coming out of you,” he said, “so much power and so much heat.” He said, “You are making me sweat.” I said, “That would be the Spirit of Jesus, the Holy Spirit that you can you feel.” Now he told me that he was into new age stuff. He had been into Buddhism. He said he knew the spirit realm very well, but he never felt anything like this kind of level of power or fire from anybody. So I just went on to tell him that Jesus is the access point to the spirit realm. Jesus said, “I am the door.” And I told him a bit more about Jesus and how he died on the cross. And as I’m telling him this I get a pain in the base of my spine. So I just thought, maybe I’m picking up on something with this guy. So I just said to him, “Have you got a problem with your spine?” And he said, “Yes.” He said, “For 14 years,” he said, “I’ve been in constant pain.” He said, “What happened was,” he said, “14 years ago I was in a bar, got involved in a fight and I was actually, my back was broken, like severe.” Breaking his back. He had surgery and sciatica. It was pressing on his sciatic nerve. He had been on liquid morphine for 14 years, but still had all this pain in his body. So I said, “You know the Spirit of Jesus you could feel coming out of me, the Holy Spirit, would you like a little bit of that power, just a little bit to go into your body and heal you?” And he was like, “Don’t mind if I do.” So I’m just sitting there and I just put my finger on his shoulder like this and I said, “I release the spirit of the power of Jesus, the healing power of Jesus now. In Jesus’ name be healed.” All the bones go back together. He had metal rods in his back. I said, “Metal come out, all pain go in Jesus’ name.” Then I said to him, “What are you feeling?” Because I always like to ask. It’s always a scary part, but I do ask what is the person feeling. And he’s like, “Nothing.” So I said, “What do you mean nothing?”
SID: You must be feeling all sorts of things.
ALISS: Yes. And I expect him to be healed, you see. So I’m like, “What do you mean you feel nothing?” And he says, “No, you don’t understand. For 14 years, I have been in constant pain. Now I feel nothing.”
SID: Wow. Now Alice has a bed and breakfast and a boutique, and tell me about someone, a man that came into your boutique and was, he’s looking for a gift or something.
ALISS: I noticed this guy, as he walked through the shop he had quite a pronounced limp, and I just got chatting to him, and I said, “What’s the trouble?” And he said, “Well 30 years ago, I was involved in a major car accident, this car wreck.” He said, “It nearly killed me.” He said, “It was terrible.” He said, “Three of my vertebrae” in his back were crushed. They thought he was going to die. He’s actually lost, he said, he lost four inches in height because his back was crushed. And he broke all his jaw and he actually lost all his teeth. They had to reconstruct his jaw. The top part of his mouth they had to put a new one in. He had bruising on his brain and he had epileptic fits now. He had pain in his body all down his legs, sciatic nerve and everything. And he would wake up very often in the morning with blood in his mouth and with, just his arms and legs were numb.
SID: Sounds like an awful life.
ALISS: I mean, terrible. They told him he was going to be in a wheelchair very soon and his hands were shaking like this ever since the accident. So I said, “Well Jesus can heal you. Can I pray for you?” And he didn’t know anything about Jesus, but he was amazing. He said, “Yeah, have a go.” I don’t know if he believed or not that it was going to work. But I started to pray and the power of God just came in such a mighty way. His knees started to buckle and he started to fall over. My husband Rob, across the other side of the shop, saw what was happening and he just raced across the shop and managed to catch him in time, and we helped him into a seat. And he’s sitting there, and you know, he couldn’t even speak because just the power of God was so strongly upon him. And he was crying, and he was crying, and he was crying. I was like, “Are you okay?” He said, “The pain is gone. The pain is gone.” And as he’s sitting there he’s trembling and he’s crying, and he can hardly speak, and he’s like “The pain is gone.” He sat for a while and I said, “Come on, just jump up.” And he said, “Last night I went to the movies. It took me 20 minute to get up from my seat.” He said, “I can’t just jump up.” I said, “Jump up in the name of Jesus because the name of Jesus is so, so powerful.” He literally jumps up out of his seat and he’s still crying, and he’s like, “I’ve grown! I’ve grown. I’m taller.” Because he was four inches short, he said. He said, “I feel taller.” We prayed for his jaw and it went numb, and he said he feels it moving around, and his hands stopped shaking. They were just perfectly still. And he stayed in the shop for maybe another couple of hours. He was so overwhelmed and he prayed to God, and he said, “God, thank you for healing me. Please come into my life. Come and fill me with your Holy Spirit.”
SID: You know, when we come back, I want you to put yourself in this situation. You’re driving a car. You’re by yourself and someone you don’t know jumps into your car, and this person has evil intentions. That’s what happened to Alice. But what happened to this person, we’ll talk about him when we come back.
SID: Jane, you teach something that I wish more people understood. If you have an unsaved friend, an unsaved family member, you have a new way to pray for them. Explain that.
JANE: Well, if God is going to pour out His spirit on all flesh, then I think that we can start praying and asking God to give that individual a dream. Because a dream bypasses all of the walls of defense that people would put up even to just coming and trying to evangelize them. But when God Himself starts to speak to them in dreams, it’s amazing. Job chapter 33 actually says God may speak one way or in another, but many times man doesn’t perceive it. Then at night in a vision while a man sleeps upon his bed, then He begins to remove pride from man so that He begins to speak into his heart. I have actually been able to sit next to somebody and interpret their dream. See, sometimes I can tell people that I’m a pastor or that I’m a prophet, but if I just tell people, you know, I interpret dreams, then that atheist will say, Oh, well, really? I had this dream. And they’ll tell me a dream, and God will open up their heart and use the prophetic word as a key through that dream.
SID: Speaking of dreams, what do you tell someone that says, I don’t dream or I don’t understand my dreams or I don’t remember my dreams, any of the above? I have an idea that the devil really tries to sabotage this wonderful vehicle God has given us.
JANE: He does. You know, because I think if you really even look at scripture you know that people even receive impartation at night when they sleep in dreams. So it’s such an important thing. And so scientists actually say that everybody dreams, it is just a matter of do we remember our dreams. And so I like to train people how to capture their dreams if they’re not remembering them, how to take the dream and interpret it if it’s actually something that’s symbolic, and how to take the message that God is bringing to us through the dream and actually apply it to our lives or to our circumstance, or how to pray even for our nation, and how to bring that forth so that we’re not just being hearers but actually doers of what God is speaking to us.
SID: Now, you’ve put together such a simplistic plan for understanding the symbols. Give us a little bit of this understanding of symbols, because a dream, you might think it is a literal thing but it really is a symbolic thing of something else.
JANE: That’s right. And I think that what we have to understand, first of all, is that there’s no just book of symbols that we can go run and look it up and say, Well, if you dream this it means this, because God will speak to individuals through their own personal language of symbolism.
SID: Right. It’s different for each person.
JANE: Exactly. If I love dogs and you don’t like dogs, that symbol is going to mean something different to different people.
JANE: And so there’s a personal language that the Holy Spirit will teach us, but I believe that there’s very basic simple, step‑by‑step ways of understanding what the symbols mean. And we’ve got to remember, we have the mind of Christ, we have the Holy Spirit inside of us, and God’s not giving us something that’s too hard to do. It is actually quite easy when we open ourselves up and ask the Holy Spirit to lead us in that process.
SID: Give me one symbol to get an idea.
JANE: Okay. How about the symbol of a house. Jesus, you know, you see something happening inside your house. Jesus said that a house actually is not really about the house, it is about the man’s life. Okay. A man that built his house on the sand versus a man that built his house on a rock. So when I have a dream, I look at where it’s taking place. If it’s taking place in a house I know what’s happening in the house is something that’s happening inside my life. If I can give you a quick example.
JANE: We were remodeling our kitchen a few years ago, and I wanted to take the wallpaper out of my kitchen and just paint it yellow. But the problem was somebody that had put the wallpaper up originally put it there to last until Jesus returned because I could not get it off the wall. And so I went back and forth, and the paint store finally said, well, prime over the wallpaper and just paint. So I did exactly that. That night I had a beautiful yellow kitchen. Well, that night I had a dream. Because my previous wallpaper had fruit along the border and vines coming down the walls, and I was so done with the vines.
JANE: I just wanted a yellow kitchen. And so that night when I dreamed though, I was sitting in my beautiful new yellow kitchen when all of a sudden the vines started growing out from under the paint. And I said, oh, my God, what’s happening. Oh, my goodness. And the voice of the Lord said to me in the dream, He said, this is what happens when you just cover up the things that are too difficult for you to deal with, they grow back. Can you see how God used the symbol of the vine to represent, the scripture talks about the root of bitterness or the things that spring up and trouble you and defile many. And things perhaps in my life that maybe I just kind of pushed to the side, covered it up, pushed to the side when God said, listen, I need to go back and deal with those issues in your heart, otherwise they’re going to spring up and they’re going to trouble you and probably defile many. So God had me look at what was happening there and knew that it was something that God needed to deal with my heart about.
SID: Okay. The presence of God is so strong.
JANE: Yes, it is.
SID: Will you pray to stir up these gifts that we start dreaming?
SID: And just as a special favor, would you also pray that we have a lot of literal dreams?
JANE: I’ll see what I can do about that one. Okay. Well, Father, we thank You, Lord, that Your people are so hungry and so desirous to hear Your voice, Lord, whether it is in prophecy, in dreams or in visions where You speak to us in pictures. And, Lord, I pray right now, God, that you would begin to bring us to an awareness of what we’re dreaming. Help us remember our dreams. Help us record our dreams. Help us to receive the impartation and the revelation that comes to us in dreams. Activate our spirit man so that we can hear You clearly, Lord, and so that we understand that when You speak literally how we’re supposed to apply those messages and how we are to be doers of what You’re speaking. Lord, if it’s something symbolic, then I pray, Lord, that through the mind of Christ, through the Holy Spirit inside of us, Lord, that You will bring clarity to each and every single and that, Lord, You will blend the symbols together into a very clear message that will touch our hearts, but, more than that, Lord, that will change the world. I thank You, Father, that you’re raising up world changers, and if You said to the early church we needed the baptism of the Holy Spirit and the mantle of revelation with dreams, visions and prophecy, then, Lord, how much more do we need it today? And so, Lord, we cry out for that. Lord, we cry out for the revival that comes when we hear Your voice. We cry out for the harvest of souls, Lord, as You pour out Your spirit on all flesh. And I thank you, Lord, for raising up those, Lord, that don’t just hear You for themselves but also hear You so that many, many can be led to Christ. In Jesus’ name.
SID: And I had a vision as Jane was praying. There is someone that has joint problems anywhere in your body, I mean it started at the head, anything you need. There’s even someone that every joint is hurting them. If you will just kind of shake and say, Jesus, thank you, all of the joint problems, fingers, elbow, every joint that you need, you’re free in Yeshua’s name.