Sid: My guest James Durham has been a chaplain for almost 30 years in the U.S. Army, but as a young man I mean literally young 3 years of age he had his first 3rd Heaven experience. But in 2009 you had an experience where you went to heaven in which you received a commission; tell me about the vision and what happened.
James: Well Sid in the vision I was lifted up to a place that seemed very strange to me at first. I saw this huge old arch door; it had hinges on both sides there was absolute no way to open the door and I stood before that door wanting to get in. I knew that I should get in but I had no means of my own to do that. And as I waited I began to pray in the Spirit asking God to help me and the door suddenly swung open and I was drawn in to that place of the secret place of the Most High God. And getting inside to the place I encountered a cloud of His glory that came and surrounded me and I soaked in the glory. And the Lord commissioned me then to begin to come to heaven on a regular basis to be trained and prepared to invite other people to come to heaven themselves.
Sid: Now the thing that intrigues me is James has received teaching on how others can do exactly what he’s been doing. Now there’s been… when you had that experience a few days later you had another vision of the Throne Room, tell me about that.
James: I was lifted back up to that same place and as I was drawn into that secret place I was aware that it was not just that place. There was a staircase that led upward and the Spirit led me upward to that staircase and as I looked up I saw an open second level open heaven from this room and I saw Jesus standing there. And Jesus called me and said “Come up here now.” And I was instantly in His presence in heaven.
Sid: And what did He tell you?
James: He told me that He had several things that He wanted me to do. And one was He said to write a book about these experiences. And it kind of went against the grain and I always said that I would never write a book and I had to back off from the words that I had spoken.
Sid: Now why would you have said that?
James: I just never saw myself writing a book; I just didn’t think that it would ever happen.
Sid: Hmm, hm.
James: So I constantly told people that I would never write a book. And the first thing that He asked me to do was write a book. And so I had to be obedient; the Lord said that for people to come to the 3rd heaven He’s going to give instructions and it’s necessary for them to obey the instructions and He was using me as an example. And so He gave me 3 commandments, things to do. The 1st one was to write the book; the 2nd one was to move. And at that time He didn’t tell me when and He didn’t say where and didn’t say how but as soon as I returned from that visit I started getting my house in order to get ready to move in obedience to the Lord. The 3rd thing he asked me to do was impart 3rd heaven visitation to other people. And I was very resistant about this because I was sharing the visions the things that had been happening to me and my experience was a lot of people thought I was about half crazy as I told them about all of these visions that I was having, the experiences that were happening. And I said “Lord, if I go back and tell people that I can impart to them 3rd heaven visitation they’re going to be convinced that I’m crazy.” And the Lord said “So who is it that you think you are?” And that was a very humbling moment and I said “I’m Your servant and I will do it.”
Sid: Okay, then a few days later you’re speaking at a Sunday service and do you decide to be obedient or did you just sit on it? (Laughing)
James: Well I asked the Lord that day “When?” And the Lord said “Sunday.” And to be obedient to the Lord I had to do it that coming Sunday and I obeyed the Lord.
Sid: What happened?
James: I decide to be obedient to the Lord and I released that impartation and I was very pleasantly surprised to see that some of them did immediately begin to have 3rd heaven experiences.
Sid: Now since that time obviously you have been praying for lots of other people for this impartation, what are you seeing?
James: I’ve seen literally 100’s of people who have had at least 1/3 heaven visit after the impartation.
Sid: Now you say something that to me that is important but I don’t totally understand it; I have not gone to heaven yet. You say that there is a need to develop our character before this occurs.
James: Yes that is correct the Lord was teaching me that not really on that visit but on subsequent visits that we really need to renew our minds. We need to root out all bitterness, unforgiveness, strife, doubt and then we need to rebuild our character.
Sid: Why are so many people having 3rd heaven experiences?
James: I believe that time is very short; we are living in the last days John said in his first letter we are living in the last hour. I believe that the Lord is preparing His bride lf Christ for His return. And the experience that I had in the 3rd heaven was to get training in instruction, correction and I believe that is what the Lord is wanting to do with the Body of Christ.
Sid: Why is it that some people do and some people do not?
James: Well I asked the Lord that on one of the 3rd heaven visits and the Lord said the number 1 reason that some people do not have the 3rd heaven visit is grace. He is going to give them specific things that He wants them to do and there are some that are not ready to obey. And if He gives them specific direction in heaven and they do not obey then a judgment will come quickly. He does not want to set people up for judgment; He wants to continue to give them grace so He waits until people are ready.
Sid: Now out of curiosity let’s assume right now you went to the 3rd heaven; will you ask a question, will you just soak in the glory, will you just be taught; what’s the norm if there is such a thing?
James: I wanted to say yes to all of the above.
Sid: (Laughing) Okay.
James: Because on some visits I say absolutely nothing; I’ve gone intending to ask questions but in the presence of the Lord I was in such awe of the Lord I couldn’t remember the questions and wound up saying absolutely nothing during that visits. I’ve also gone at times when the Lord was conducting a class; usually there’s a number of people present in the class when he teaches.
Sid: When you say a number how many would you say
James: I’d say 30 or 40.
Sid: Did you recognize any of them?
James: I have recognized a few of them.
Sid: Could you tell me one.
James: Well I rather not mention the names of anyone but some of the people that we’ve mentored I’ve seen a couple of them there.
Sid: Now these are people that have had 3rd heaven experiences?
James: Some have and some are not aware of having 3rd heaven visit yet I saw them there.
Sid: Okay, a million dollar question. Why did God choose you to teach people how to go to 3rd heaven?
James: I believe the Lord chose me because basically I was unknown; I’m just an average every day person and I think the Lord chose someone that if others heard about heaven would say “If he can go, I can go.” If someone is really famous or someone with a big name goes everyone says “Well of course, that’s who they are.” But if someone unknown just an average person visits heaven it tells people “I can do that too.”
Sid: …briefly explain what you teach.
James: What I teach in that is God had such a heart of love for us that He wanted to manifest Himself to us and teach us about His attributes and help us to get deep relationship with Him to come into unity of His Spirit and so He made a very dramatic move to be able to come to us 7 different stages of glory beginning on the mountain top meeting with Moses. And coming down eventually through Yeshua His glory was personally manifested in Yeshua and the in the coming of the Holy Spirit. Then the Lord wants us to be drawn back to Him through 7 levels of glory. And the Lord revealed to me that first of all, that 7th level of Him coming down the Holy Spirit is really our first level of connecting to go back to Him. The indwelling of the Holy Spirit is really the first level of glory we experience of God. Then from there like on the first day of Pentecost we go through empowering glory; up to gifted glory to joy to Shalom to intimacy, and then finally unity.
Sid: You know on tomorrows broadcast I want you to explain what the glory really is because as I understand the glory that is the age that we’re living in right now that we can be walking in this glory. And people wherever we are the glory shows up and their healed and someone’s back and neck was just healed in Jesus Name. But the thing “Beyond the Ancient Door,” and “The 7 Levels of Glory,” and the 3 CD teaching will equip you with prayers of impartation to enter into the glory realm; enter the secret place, enter the 3rd heaven. This is your moment; aren’t you tired of just reading about what other people are doing; it’s the last act of the last play just before the conclusion and you’re being called; what are you going to do about it?
Sid: I can’t think of anything anywhere that will make you have a greater passion for the Messiah than Bree Keyton’s new book called “The Passion, What Does it Mean?” And it was birthed out of a vision that she had in May of 1993. Bree I know on yesterday you explained that vision but would you explain it again, but with far more detail.
Bree: When I saw Jesus receiving His stripes, and that’s what the vision was in May of 1993. It was an absolutely unbelievably graphic and bloody vision. And people who are afraid to look at that I think that they’re going to miss the absolute majesty of what He took for us. The plan of God that He would suffer, come as the Lamb of God, the Passover Lamb, and suffer for us. So this vision was very bloody and very graphic and I saw swirling around Jesus skin and blood and tiny droplets just like a fizz a mist all around Him to the point that it was like a little cloud was around Him as He was being beaten and whipped and mocked and hit. And these were the things that I saw in my vision it made me fall on my face and weep for 3 days. After that came the song “Stripes” which we played yesterday. And then subsequently over 3 years of fasting, and praying the songs “Nails, Thorns and the Blood” and then of course the books which you know about culminating with this book “The Passion, What Does it Mean.” These are books that came out of time spent with Father God in a way that only God could have shown me these things. So there’s a lot of revelation in this book that I know is going to touch hearts.
Sid: On yesterday’s broadcast you brought out something that very few Christians have ever heard anywhere, and it has to do with some of the things that happened in Jesus Life. Some of the phrases he even said, and explain some of these things from your book.
Bree: Let’s back up to palm… what we call Palm Sunday it was really the day that Jesus entered Jerusalem. That was a marvelous day; what a celebration. The High Priest would leave the Temple Mount and all of the Priests would line the streets with their palm fronds in their hands. And the High Priest would head out of the city toward Bethlehem to select the Passover lamb. Now Bethlehem was where all of the sacrificial animals for the temple were bred and he would go and select a perfect little lamb to be their Passover lamb and he would lead it back to the city. And as he did the priest lining the streets would shout “Blessed be the king that commeth in the Name of the Lord.” On this particular day when Jesus triumphantly entered the city of Jerusalem he came from the other direction after the High Priest had left. And of course He entered the city as our high priest and as our Passover Lamb at the same time. And He came in and He was in the city for several days and then of course they had Him arrested. Now when He went to the cross the very words He spoke from the cross “I thirst, and it is finished” were the very words the High Priest was speaking on the temple mount at that precise time. The High Priest would begin to sacrifice the lamb and he would say the words “I thirst” at that moment Jesus said “I thirst.” And then he would sacrifice the lamb and he would sprinkle it with blood on the altar. And He would say the words “It is finished.” At that moment Jesus spoke the words “It is finished!”
Sid: So you’re saying for 100’s of years before at that moment the high priest would say these words and then Jesus fulfilled those words.
Bree: Perfect fulfillment of the Feast of Passover, what a marvelous, marvelous thing to get it into our hears that each and everything that He took on his way to that cross had meaning and purpose for us and with a fulfillment of 100’s of prophecies about Messiah. But also a perfect fulfillment of the shadow pictures of the Feast of Passover.
Sid: And on yesterday’s broadcast we didn’t get a chance to finish it, but actually why don’t you start out as you point out in your book what would happen in Israel with the lamb with a normal Passover and how that was a shadow of Jesus.
Bree: Well they would take the little lamb; now on the Temple Mount of course they would have this little lamb inspected and it had to be perfect without spot or wrinkle, just as our Messiah was perfect without spot or wrinkle. And in each home in Israel they would sacrifice a lamb, put the blood over their doorpost and then they would have their feast where they would consume the lamb. Now this is something that had been done down through the millennia by the Hebrew people. I mean year after year, century after century, yet when Messiah came they did not recognize Him because they were expecting a Messiah that would ride in on a white horse and charge in and run the Roman’s out of there and take over and triumph as the anointed King. Of course we know that there is going to be a day when He will return as the anointed King; of course He is anointed as the Son of God. But this time He came as the suffering Savior to pay a terrible price for our sin, yours and mine.
Sid: Now it was prophesied that His disciples would shout “Blessed be the King that comes in the name of the Lord.” How was that fulfilled?
Bree: when He entered that city his disciples took up the cry; the same cry that the high priest had all the other priests shout as he came into the city they would shout that this particular Passover they shouted “Yeshua, the Messiah of God.” And the high priest of our salvation entered the city. And the priests heard this they were angry because they looked and they saw; “Well, this is not the High Priest that we were expecting; this is another person, this is just Jesus of Nazareth, you hush up.” And of course I’m paraphrasing everything. And he said “I will not hush up; He said….
Sid: I was going to ask you “What version of the Bible was that?” I’m just teasing but go ahead.
Bree: Well, I’m paraphrasing but anyway he said “If they will not shout it on this day even the rocks will cry this out.” So you see this was preordained oh you know 100’s and 100’s of years in advance when the first Passover began in Egypt these things were preordained by the living God. He set things up because He had a magnificent plan to bring His son through a virgin that all might be saved.
Sid: You know in your book you go into such detail from a Hebraic understanding of the Passion. One of the things that intrigued me I’d never heard this before in your chapter about attacks against the mind and of course before that you talk about the thorns. But you talk about this Japanese doctor that made an amazing discovery about the heart, explain.
Bree: Yes, there was a doctor that actually found brain cells in the heart. Now this is a recent discovery, but you know God knew this. God knew this and he even had his prophet write this in Proverbs 23.7 says “As he thinketh in his heart.” How can you think in your heart? See God knew, God knew because he created us; “as a man thinketh in his heart so is he.” And in Matthew 12 it says “For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh.” We know that the heart and mind are intertwined from a book by Daniel Denune which connects mental health with heart health. And it’s been really found that when people have mental stress it causes obstruction in the heart coronary artery disease caused by mental stress.
Sid: Tell me about the CD, and it’s really nicely packaged this book and CD. The book is called “The Passion, What does it mean?” She goes into such detail that very few Christians understand from Hebraic eyes but you have a song in your CD. We played yesterday the one called “Stripes” and you have one called “Nails.” Tell me what is the purpose of “Nails” and what is the purpose of the song and what happens when people hear this?
Bree: When they hear the song “Nails” there have been a number of people that have been just delivered on the spot. Delivered of demonic oppressions, delivered from attacks against them in their minds, their bodies, their spirits; everywhere that the devil would try to attack a person to try to destroy them. And many have been set free just a couple of months ago there was a woman who was pregnant and she was about to lose her baby and she really felt that she was under demonic attack. She heard this song at a Bible study; people actually use these songs for Bible studies. And she heard it at a Bible study and 7 demons came screaming out of her in front of about 8 people. And I mean she was astonished and everyone else. But this is the sort of thing that we have dozens upon dozens of reports like this of people being delivered.
Sid: And what you talk about is… and again I haven’t seen this elsewhere what the nails actually were and the fact that many people during that time were crucified without nails, explain that to us.
Bree: Well Jesus was nailed to the cross and we know that that had to happen because there was prophecy about it. Back in Psalm 22 it says “They looked on him who whom they pierced.” That was a prophecy that He would be nailed to the cross, not tied to the cross and most criminals were just simply tied to the cross. But Jesus was a violent offender to the kingdom of darkness, as we know he was the most violent offender. And so they nailed Him to the cross. Nails really set us free and delivered us, body, soul and spirit as God set us free through the hammering, through the horror of what He took in His hands and feet. You know our hands and our feet often do wickedness and these are areas where God wanted to set us free the works of our hands, feet run to do wickedness. Yet Jesus was nailed to that cross in a permanent kind of way, He could not get free. And of course He allowed Himself to be nailed to that cross to set us free from all of the attacks of the wicked one.
Sid: Okay, Bree we’re out of time but we’re going to play that selection “Nails” on tomorrow’s broadcast and I’m expecting many people to be set free.
Sid: Well, my guest Larry Randolph is red hot for the Messiah, he has a very well respected gift of prophecy but he was as messed up as everyone of us was. At one point in his life he had this negative image of himself as almost any one you can image; it’s a miracle he’s who he is today. And a lot had to do with a visitation he had from the Lord when he was in his twenties; tell me about that.
Larry: Yes Sid that plays into the story line we’re talking about insecurity and not being a copy. I was in my early 20’s and as was said in the last session that I had just finished with playing with the gospel group and decided; the Lord decided I was going to do something different. So I settle into my first year of being kind of an assistant staff pastor at a church in Arkansas. I was going to sleep one evening in Fall I think it was the end of September the first of October; my bed was by the window. There was a window right by my bed that looked right into the yard where great oak trees were at and the leaves had been falling off the trees and it was turning autumn and the leaves were falling off at that time of the year. And as I was drifting off to sleep I was awakened by the sound of a leaf crunching under someones foot. Now, and I heard it at the front of the house and it was coming; I could hear it walking toward my bedroom where I was laying not even 12 inches from a window open with a screen over the window letting the autumn air blow in over my face. And immediately I was afraid because I thought it was a burglar because there was a rumor that burglar’s was in the area; so fear gripped me. But as I heard the steps I could hear; it wasn’t a dream, it wasn’t a vision I was wide awake and I could hear the steps turn the house coming toward the window. And when the steps turned the corner the Spirit of God fell on me as heavy as I’ve ever felt that anointing of the Holy Spirit and up to the window the Lord comes and it was Jesus the Messiah. And He bent over and put His face; the cheek of His face by the screen of the window. Now at this point He hadn’t said a word to me but all of a sudden the whole room turned into what I call liquid agape; liquid love.
Sid: I understand that because the day I got saved that’s what happened to me; so I know exactly what you’re talking about go ahead.
Larry: Yeah, it was like there was a fog in the room and it was the most beautiful, warm inviting red color that I’ve every seen. And I realized that red fog in the room was visible manifest liquid love of this Jesus. And as it begin to settle on me I couldn’t hardly breath because it was so heavy; but when I began to breathin like everything in me that was insecure would leave; everything in me that was fearful was medicated by this wonderful love of God. And I realized at that moment Sid a couple of things, not realized..I realized because the Lord…how do I say it He spoke audible words later; this time it was just thoughts coming from Him. And I realized that just His attitude; His posture was this, “I love you unconditionally, there’s nothing that you could ever do or ever say; there’s nothing that you could ever do different that would ever deter My love for you; you’re unconditionally accepted, unconditionally loved and you’re in my embrace forever and forever.” And that was the most overwhelming thing I’d ever in my life felt from anyone, from anything that unconditional love was available to me for the rest of my life if I would embrace this. And then after laying there I began to weep and the Lord then He spoke to me and these words were audible he said “Look at your hands.” And I thought that’s interesting you know Jesus comes all the way from heaven and He tells me to look at my hands.” And I thought that He would give me a revelation or something you know, and it was and I just didn’t know it. So I looked at my hands and he said as I looked at my hands He said “Look close at your hands.” And I looked close and this is what He said to me out of Psalms 139:14 David said “For I am awesomely and wonderfully (that word wonderfully is distinctly, uniquely made by the marvelous works of God.” Which are the unique or disctinct works of God. So He quoted that scripture to me of David said; “I am marvelously and wonderfully made by God.” And He began to say to me that “There is no one that has your hands, no one has your fingerprints Larry; no one has your DNA, no one has your mind, no one has your gifting; you are a unique expression of an original breath that I breathed into Adam in Genesis 1 that has been transferred now and I’m breathing that into you and I want you to live your life like that.” He said this about my hands “I don’t want you to ever hit anyone with your hands, I don’t want you to push with your hands, I don’t want you to slap with your hands, I don’t want you to have a closed fist. I don’t want your hand to be closed in greed, I want you to live with an open hand; a unique open hand; a hand of loving, a hand of caring, a hand of blessing; a hand of ordination; a hand of healing; a hand of comfort. Because…here’s what He said to me that so floored me Sid He said “Larry you are my…you and the rest of the people of God are My hands extended on this earth; I can’t be there in a physical form you have to do for me what I would do if I was there.”
Sid: And what you’re saying is “Could you picture Jesus making a fist and socking someone in the nose?” Never in a million years.
Larry: Never, never.
Sid: But and you know what Larry was told by God transformed his life and allowed him to step into his destiny. But God is saying the same thing to you; Larry would you speak on behalf of God to those listening and let them know that what God said to you He’s saying to them right now.
Larry: Absolutely and so yes when He said “Look at your hands and your my hands extended and He said “When you touch people; when you love people it’s the same as me touching them and loving them; I’m doing it through you I am the breath in your breath; I am the DNA in your DNA, I am all that I am you can be because the scripture says “As He is so are we in this world.” And Sid, I wasn’t like that, I was insecure; I was…bad self image so something had to change. And I began to think “Someone’s got to change, well God changes not so guess what, (Laughing) that bad image of me has to change.” So I had to adopt an image of a God that loved me and that would want to use my hands and made me unique. And this is what He said to me you know “Larry if you don’t be what I’ve made you to be; if you don’t lose your false image or this low self-esteem and this shyness, if you don’t become what I’ve called you to be the world will go without seeing that that’s part of my personality because you are a unique once in a lifetime Mona Lisa no one else can copy who you are; you’re not supposed to do someone else’s ministry I’ve called you to do your ministry and your ministry is reflect a part of My heart that only you understand and know because I have given you an original breath that others don’t have; they have their own original breath.” So He said to me “Never be a copy; most Christians are born to overcome and most Christians are born originals, the tragedy is that they die a copy.” And as I did right then and I speak to the people out there listen when God breathed into you; when God, what I mean even at birth. Because Roman’s says 8:29 it says “Those who He foreknew He predestined.” That word predestined is horenso where we get our Latin word horizon in other words He set your horizon. If He foreknew you He set the landscape of your life; He gave you a personal landscape, a personal horizon that was to be conformed into the image of God. That’s what Paul said in the Book of Romans; so I say to you that even at birth God breathed an original breath into you that was like Him full of healing, full of love, full of compassion, full of wholeness, full of entrepreneurship, full of creativity, full of gifting, so that’s who you are in God. And if you are not that and you feel other things then those are nothing but false feelings that are trying to circumvent or trying to usurp rather the place of the Christ that lives in you. Because what did Paul say “Greater is He that’s in me then he that’s in the world.” And he said he lived by that greatness of Christ in him. So I’d like to encourage people out there to find your path, and to find out who God has called you to be. God’s not called me to pick up Smith Wigglesworth’s anointing as much as I respect that; He hasn’t called me to pick up Kathryn Kuhlman’s anointing as much as I respect that. I have an anointing that they didn’t have that no one else has and it would be a shame in God’s ecosystem for your to die and not be you and the world go without seeing what God has invested in you. The world already knows what He’s invested in other people; so being a copy of someone else I don’t mean it’s bad and I don’t mean you can’t use and facilitate some of their anointing but the world is not looking for a redo of someone else. The world is looking for someone who carries an authentic expression of a God who’s so big that He had to have 10 names just to capture His personality in the Old Testament. Jehovah Shalom, Jehovah Nissi, Jehovah Rapha. I mean that’s how big His personality is even 10 names couldn’t capture all of His personality. So, I would just like to encourage people to be yourself, break through the restraints that are on you or the abuses that you suffered as a child or the insecurities or the ways…because that’s not who you are; that is the diagram or the blueprint of the enemy to distract you from being the overcoming expression of a wonderful God who made you after His own image.
Sid: You know what another d is coming to me besides distract; it’s the plan of the enemy to destroy you; not just distract you but destroy you…..later on in the week Larry I would like you to talk about the 10 prophetic words that you see coming globally in the future. You told me that you were at a conference and you saw a globe and you saw what was going to be happening to places all over the world. And perhaps on tomorrow’s broadcast Larry I would like you to talk about major prophecies God has given you; documented that you gave them before they happened and then they came to pass. So this is your moment to be the original that God’s created you to be.
Sid: My guest is red hot for the Messiah, his name is Gordon Robertson you see him every day on the 700 Club. And we found out on yesterday’s broadcast that his grandfather was a Senator, a US Senator. And his father of course you know Pat Robertson, Yale graduate, could have written his own ticket with the grace corporation. But God called him into ministry and the rest is history. Now the last thing Gordon wanted to do seeing what effect ministry had on a household, he didn’t want to go in the ministry even though he had prophecies early on. But he had prepared for a business career, he had a fine job in a law firm, then as the story goes he was minding his own business and a pastor that’s a mutual friend of both of ours John Jimenez called him, what happened Gordon?
Gordon: Well I was sitting in my office looking down the main street of Norfolk, Virginia, and John Jimenez called me up and it was a Thursday afternoon. And he said “Gordon I had a dream about you last night” and I said “That’s interesting John.” And he said “In my dream you went with me on my mission trip to India.” Then he added to that “I believe God wants you to go with me on this trip.”
Sid: Stop, the minute he said that what went on inside of your Gordon?”
Gordon: I frankly wanted to laugh at him.
Gordon: Well the concept that God wanted me to do anything at that point in life was sort of “Nah.” It just didn’t click.
Sid: Were you backslidden?
Gordon: Yeah, I was going to church but I wasn’t in any stretch of the imagination I wasn’t a Christian.
Sid: What year was this?
Gordon: It was 1994.
Sid: So how does someone that is a son of a man that’s probably affected as many if not more people of anyone of this generation for the gospel be in a position like that?
Gordon: Well your heart just starts to get hardened is I guess one way to put it. Another is the just the phenomenon of the preacher’s kid and the part of establishing your own identity you tend to rebel against your parents. Like all teenagers go through that but with preacher’s kid there’s also the rebelling against what society is expecting you to do and how you’re expected to act. And so it’s almost like you’ve got to go out there and prove you’re bad.
Sid: Okay, but with John Jimenez you laughed but the question I have for you is why did you even entertain the thought of going coming from a posture like you were in?
Gordon: Because I knew John Jimenez for over 30 years and when I was a child I would go to John Jimenez’s church back when Rock Church was on Lens Avenue. And I knew the presence of God was there. And so when John Jimenez would say to me, I thank God I could God I could not dismiss that. I couldn’t just on his face reject it because of what I knew as a child.
Sid: But you still had a degree of a fleece on whether it was God or not with a Visa.
Gordon: Well that was just my lawyer brain kicking in, because I couldn’t just laugh at him and say “John you’re out of your mind.” I said… my lawyer brain kick in and I knew India and the United States don’t have wonderful relations, they’re better now than they used to be but you still needed a Visa. I knew that the embassy for India was in Washington, DC we were down in Norfolk, Virginia. I found out he’s calling me Thursday afternoon and I found out he was leaving Monday morning; and I just figured with my lawyer brain that there’s no way that you could process the paperwork in that period of time. That it was just going to be physically impossible for this thing to happen so I heard my self say “Okay, I’ll go if you can get the Visa. And 24 hours later…
Gordon: He calls me with the Visa so I’m stuck I’ve got to go. Monday morning I find myself on an Air India flight from John F. Kennedy to Delhi.
Sid: Was it so easy to get off that quick from your law practice?
Gordon: No, it wasn’t easy at all. I didn’t have any trials of anything so I had to transfer my case load but I’ve grown up in the tradition that once you give your word it’s your bond so once you’ve said yes you can’t go back.
Sid: Okay, you find yourself in India and then you get the biggest shock of your life because to my understanding you’ve never preached before but what did John say to you?
Gordon: He came to me we were scheduled to be there a week and there was a whole series of gospel tent meetings going on in the city called Rajahmundry. He came to me one day and he said “You’re going to preach tomorrow.” Which kind of surprised me, I didn’t anticipate that that was going to be part of the assignment. I thought I was sort of all on the ride, you know as the young lawyer who they were going to look to me at some point in time and ask me for money.
Gordon: That I sort of thought that I was going to be the deep pocket to make all of this happen and my pockets weren’t all that deep at that point in time. So when he came to me and said “You’re going to preach.” I was dumbfounded and I…
Sid: Did you entertain going back on the next plane?
Gordon: Well that was part of the problem there was no airport, and Rajahmundry we flew to Delhi and then flew on to Madras and then took a 12 hour train ride to get to Rajahmundry.
Sid: And every minute of it you were probably thinking “Now I know why I’m not a missionary.”
Gordon: (Laughing) Well you have two reactions and the one is “What can I do to help?” and the other “How can I get out of here?” There really is no in between and you see the disease and the poverty and just horrible living conditions in some areas of India. And you’re either broken by it or it breaks your heart. And I found myself being strangely heartbroken over it. And here people made in the image of God were literally living like animals and what could I do about it.
Sid: Okay, I’ve got to hear about that night you preached for the first time in your life, were there very many people there?
Gordon: We had 15,000 Hindu’s.
Sid: Fifteen thousand, wait a second, Mishpochah how would you like to have that for your first assignment 15,000 Hindu’s. How would you like that Bob and Janie? So how would you like that Gordon, how did it work out?
Gordon: I thought I was horrible, all I did was I remembered some things that my father used to preach and so you know you grow up in a preaching family you’re going to hear a whole lot of sermon’s along the way. And so I just repeated some of the things that I heard him speak and I didn’t know how to do altar calls. At that point in my life I didn’t know anything about Hinduism or what they needed to hear. I had prayed a great deal for the first time in a while “God you got to help me because I’m here and I’m here because John had a dream. So if anything is going to work it’s not going to be because of me.” And I didn’t know how to give an altar call so I just you know spoke and stopped and sat down. To my amazement people started coming forward. I had been at other meetings and this had not happened so I mean there had been earlier meetings during the week where this people had not come forward. And so when people were coming forward I didn’t know what was going on. And one couple came up to me and they said “We are Brahmin’s.” And at that time Brahmin’s never became Christians because it meant that they left everything. They would leave their families, they would leave their jobs, they would leave their community, they would be considered outcasts. But with tears in their eyes they said to me “We cannot help but believe in this Jesus you’re talking about, you’re words have pierced our hearts like arrows,” and they wanted to be baptized. You know at this point and it wasn’t until I saw their eyes and their tears that I finally figured out there was something really going on here that had nothing to do with me. And that God was really doing something.
Sid: Well you felt really good about this but then your buddy John Jimenez had another dream. You’re ready to go home and what does he say to you?
Gordon: The day before we were supposed to leave and get back on the 12 hour train to come back to the nearest airport to fly out of there and he comes to me and says “Gordon, I had another dream about you, you’re supposed to stay and I’m supposed to go home.”
Sid: Have you told this guy maybe you should be drinking more coffee and dreaming less? (Laughing)
Gordon: (Laughing) Well because of what had happened when I had spoken and really because of that Brahmin couple. I mean that was an amazing event and it was not just an amazing event for me it was also an amazing event for everyone else around.
Sid: I’ll tell you what “Hold that thought we’ll pick up right here on tomorrow’s broadcast. Mishpochah I am speaking through the eyes of faith right now but I believe this whole movie “The Passion” was to reach Jewish people. You see if history doesn’t testify to that because this is God’s time to reach Jewish people with the gospel….
Sid: I’ve been talking all of this week to Trisha Frost about her book on “Bound” Breaking Free from Life’s Entanglements.” Trish is you and Jack could get free from the mess, I mean you were sabotaged from day one, from the mess you were sabotaged in anyone can get free. What is the Number 1 issue you find as you talk to people about being free from their strongholds?
Trisha: Well I think that it’s abandonment in the people that I relate to because so many people they have basically been abandoned whether it’s been from a father, or if it’s been from a spiritual father, or of course your father of origin or whatever. That’s how you begin to relate to your heavenly Father. Well you can’t believe you have value, and I see that over and over that when people don’t feel that they have a place of value they live life beneath and below their potential. You know they just can’t believe that their purpose is supernatural. You know I believe in my heart that nobody and that’s why I love the name of your show is because I think that it’s the most supernatural thing we can do to live our natural lives pursuing the things that have wounded us; the things that hinder us from living out our destiny. How do we define our destiny? Well I think that you define your destiny at some point in time by uncovering the things that have hindered you from living and walking in your destiny. And so I see it over and over again people that feel like they’ve been abandoned in life, so they’ve used the excuse well “I can’t.” I’ve taken “I can’t” out of my vocabulary. I can do all things through Jesus, I can live my destiny, I can live my purpose you know whenever I’m on a journey pursuing purpose and destiny. And you know after Jack died I felt abandoned, I felt abandoned by Jack. What am I going to do? You know I have lived my life dependent on Father God to always be there or Jack to always be there. I’ve never had to be the lead person, I never had to be the one in charge and now what am I going to do now that I have this huge ministry that’s just been dumped in my lap so to speak. I had no clue Sid, and so as I begin to pursue what is the things that are hindering me. Well first of all it was the belief that I had been abandoned, I had to deal with that belief, well to start with that’s a lie. I had not been abandoned because the word tells us that He’ll never leave us or forsake us. So if I’ve not been abandoned then Father I need for You to show me a plan. You know, what is the plan, what is the purpose for my life. And He’s doing that, day by day step by step.
Sid: Yeah, but you had something that I have to tell you sure provokes me to jealousy. Now I know that it didn’t start out that way but you’re kind of minding your own business and the Arc Angel Michael shows up, you’ve got to tell me about that.
Trisha: Well I’m just sitting out on my porch thanks to Jack’s mother that passed away and left us a beautiful enough money to buy this beautiful piece of property on the inlet waterway. Which was fulfilling Jack’s dream and so we built this beautiful house and Jack was able to live there only 6 weeks before he went on to be with the Lord. But I’ve lived there since Jack’s passing and so you know at the beginning of this year you know Jack has been gone 7 years. And although I miss him and have had to deal with abandonment life goes on. And so we’re starting our 8th year of new beginnings. And I just love the fact that 8 represents new beginnings. And so I’m sitting on my porch and I’m not fully wake yet and all of a sudden I look up and there is this huge angel, you know and he is huge. And he’s sitting on this beautiful horse and he’s suspended over the waterway in midair. And I look up and you know you hear about things like this Sid and I’m sure that you see a lot of this but I’ve never experienced seeing an angel but only one other time. And so I’m sitting there and there he is and I guess just being female or whatever my curiosity is peaked and so I began to ask questions. “Who are you?” And then that’s when he told me that I am Michael the warring angel, I’m Michael of the angel army.” And so I asked him I said “What are you doing here?” I should have known the answer to that question but I didn’t it just didn’t dawn on me. And he said “It’s taken me 7 years to break through the heavenlies on your behalf but we’re here now.” And when he said “We, I only saw him so I’m thinking who is we.” And at that moment it’s just like a veil was removed from behind him and all around suspended in midair all up and down the waterway was angels as far as you could see was angels back to back. And so I asked him “What is this all about?” And he goes “We are here on your behalf and you can ask the father to commission us to give us assignments to whatever Father is doing in your life.” And still today, and you know that was at the first of the year still today those angels are there in my prayer time. I asked the Father, Father would you show me what the assignment is for my angels today. And by one by one we ask, I asked the Father to give these angels assignments, I have charged, the Bible tells us “He will give angels to have charge over you. And look at all of the stories in the Bible where Father God sent ministering angels to his servants and so they’re there. And every day and especially when I go out and I teach you know on the…
Sid: Have you seen anything different since that encounter when you minister to people?
Trisha: We have seen an increase in our ministry and it’s not an increase of finances, I’m not looking for that. I have seen an increase in gifts in the gifting’s that Father God has given each one of his children. You know whenever I travel now I hear words of knowledge, I see people… it’s amazing to me to where I’m minding my own business again and I’ll be teaching on whatever topic the church has brought me into teach on and all of a sudden this light will go off over somebody’s head.
Sid: Now when you say a light explain to me what you see.
Trisha: Well I see a light go off it’s like a flood light and I’ll be standing up and you know you’ll be in a room with anywhere… I go to seminars and I teach from anywhere from 100 to a 1000 and I’ll be teaching and I’ll be going through my points it’s usually on the orphan mind set. And then I’ll look at someone and that light will go off and I literally have to pause my teaching and listen for a minute. I have to invite the presence of the Holy Spirit to come and He begins to just fill my thoughts, He begins to fill my heart with words that He wants to speak to that individual.
Sid: Give me an example of a real life situation where a spotlight went off on someone and you gave them a word.
Trisha: I was in North Carolina doing some meetings The Orphan Heart Sonship is usually my favorite topic and all of a sudden there was this couple right in front of me and this floodlight went off over their head. And I’m looking at them and I get the word builder. So I have the couple standup and I just look at him and I told him I don’t even remember the whole word but basically the word was around building. That Father God… “You’re called to be a builder in the Kingdom of God and I told him son, I don’t know what you do in the Kingdom of God but I know that God has called you to build, build, build. And there’s a dream in your heart that you’ve just kind of forgotten about and the Lord is going to take that dream He’s breathing life back on that dream because that dream is to build in the Kingdom.” And he started crying and then I looked at his wife and I had her stand up and I said “Sweetheart the Lord has not forgotten you, you feel as though you have been forgotten or you’ve been abandoned or rejected; He wants you to know that He sees the desires in your heart.” And so I asked her I said “I feel like,” well I asked her, “Have you ever thought about adopting children?” And I asked them you all have 2 children and they actually had 2 children. And I said “Do you want any more children?” And she just began to weep and she couldn’t have any more children. And so with the Lord I said “I see adoption, you guys are going to adopt children.” Well after the meeting I went on and started preaching again, I hate to say preaching I just said sharing. And so after the meetings they came walking up to me and they both were still crying and he told me he goes, “I’m a builder he goes, I have a construction company.” And then she began to cry and she told me “I just took my name off of the adoption list because I had lost hope that we would ever get a child.” And the dream that they both had was they felt like the Lord told them that they were supposed to go to another town and that they were going to build a church but the doors just seemed to never open up so they just lost the hope for that dream. Well that day life was breathed back into that dream and they began to dream again and the pastor just got so excited for them because he’s been trying to encourage them to dream that dream again. You know to ask God to breathe life on it. So we prayed and I commissioned one of my angels and I said “And I just ask the Lord to give that angel assignment to cause this dream to come to fruition.” And I haven’t spoken to them but one time since then but they are making plans to actually go to this town and I think that it’s going to be like another campus for the church that I was at. But to go to this other town and they’re going to start a church in that other town. And she went and she put her name back on the adoption list.
Sid: You know I’m thinking about your description of about the way you were and the way that your husband was, if you two hadn’t been free you’d never be able to be freeing all of these other people. But think about all of the people that are listening to us right now Trish that they want that freedom for themselves, they want that freedom for their family….